The Watering Hole

tard is spelt with an 'A' :)

CraigBert — Feb 06, 2009By the way, "turd" is spelled with a "U."  ;) ;D

Not in Alabama. ;D

A religious argument for herb! :D



“And the Earth brought forth grass and herb-yielding seed after its kind and the tree yielding fruit, whose seed was in itself after its kind: and God saw that it was good.” Genesis: Chapt. 1: Verse 12 (King James Version of the Bible, unless noted).



“God makes the Earth yield healing herbs, which the prudent man should not neglect.” Sirach: 38:4 (Catholic Bible.)



“Not that which goeth into the mouth defileth a man; That which cometh out of the mouth defileth a man.” Jesus, quoted: Matt. 15:11.



“In later times, some shall

CraigBert — Feb 06, 2009I had a roommate once who contracted emphysema from smoking pot.  He never smoked cigarettes.  So I think that last statement is probably false.

There are studies that show that pot helps with emphysema also. Maybe he got emphysema from second hand cig. smoke. :D

It could also be inherited. There are other causes of emphysema. Your assuming it was caused by smoking pot. Bad boy. Do not assume, you here me. ;D

http://www.ehealthmd.com/library/Emphysema/EMP_causes.html

"Cigarette smoking is by far the most dangerous reason that people develop emphysema, and it is also the most preventable cause. Other risk factors include a deficiency of an enzyme called alpha-1-antitrypsin, air pollution, airway reactivity, heredity, male sex, and age."

Hookbender — Feb 09, 2009[quote author=CraigBert link=1233705301/25#42 date=1233884276]I had a roommate once who contracted emphysema from smoking pot.  He never smoked cigarettes.  So I think that last statement is probably false.

There are studies that show that pot helps with emphysema also. Maybe he got emphysema from second hand cig. smoke. :D

It could also be inherited. There are other causes of emphysema. Your assuming it was caused by smoking pot. Bad boy. Do not assume, you here me. ;D

http://www.ehealthmd.com/library/Emphysema/EMP_causes.html


No, I didn't assume anything - I, personally, couldn't care less.  Obviously his doctor did the assuming since that was where the diagnosis came from.

http://www.IthinkifIaddlinks.peoplewillbelievewhatIsay.evenifImfullofshit.com

Whatever that link is to doesn't work. ;D ;D ;D ;D

How do you know what the doctor said? Were you there?

Did the doctor check into his family history to check if this could have been inherited? What about all the other possibilities? Did he check on them?

OR.....did your friend walk in and say something like....."I smoke more weed than most people, like everyday all day, and here are my problems....blah blah blah. Then the doctor says, "yep, that must be the problem, let's fix it best we can."?

Point is, doctors, like family doctors, really don't give a damn what caused your problem....they just try to fix it. I've never had a doctor ask what caused my cold, he just gave me medicine to fix it. What difference would it make why or how I got the cold? He's not studying how to resolve the problem, that's already been done.

This discussion is pointless. When someone has decided to subscribe to a belief, and then vehemently defended that position, regardless of what info may be available, then you no longer have a rational conversation. Simply no point in discussing it further. I know pot is bad for the lungs, my own life experience tells me this. I don't think it should be illegal, I am sure Oreo cookies kill more people than weed, something being detrimental to one's well being has never been a basis for outlawing it.

Pot heads discredit their arguments when they follow this line of reasoning Hook. It is one thing to say "It should not be illegal", it is quite another to say that it is completely harmless. As I said once already, look at the bong water in your bong after a few good sessions, you don't think that shit gathers in your lungs too? I ruined my voice smoking herb. I never once ever touched a tobacco product, and as of about 10 years ago I have had a voice that sounds like someone who has smoked his whole life, it was the pot smoke irritating my vocal chords. I KNOW this, not only from common sense observation, but from ore than one doctor's analysis.

Again, I love weed, I have nothing against it at all, but to say it is good for you, or even harmless, is just plain stupid. Not saying you are stupid, just that you are repeating some stupid information that you have picked up somewhere.

BTW, from your quote above, I think the smoke from weed would easily qualify as air pollution, no mater how good it smells.

spaivxx — Feb 10, 2009This discussion is pointless. When someone has decided to subscribe to a belief, and then vehemently defended that position, regardless of what info may be available, then you no longer have a rational conversation. Simply no point in discussing it further. I know pot is bad for the lungs, my own life experience tells me this. I don't think it should be illegal, I am sure Oreo cookies kill more people than weed, something being detrimental to one's well being has never been a basis for outlawing it.

Pot heads discredit their arguments when they follow this line of reasoning Hook. It is one thing to say "It should not be illegal", it is quite another to say that it is completely harmless. As I said once already, look at the bong water in your bong after a few good sessions, you don't think that shit gathers in your lungs too? I ruined my voice smoking herb. I never once ever touched a tobacco product, and as of about 10 years ago I have had a voice that sounds like someone who has smoked his whole life, it was the pot smoke irritating my vocal chords. I KNOW this, not only from common sense observation, but from ore than one doctor's analysis.

Again, I love weed, I have nothing against it at all, but to say it is good for you, or even harmless, is just plain stupid. Not saying you are stupid, just that you are repeating some stupid information that you have picked up somewhere.

BTW, from your quote above, I think the smoke from weed would easily qualify as air pollution, no mater how good it smells.

A belief? I have done no such thing. I provided studies that contradict myths, speculation, and superstitious reasoning. I provided case studies that are just  tad more convincing than your personal thoughts. I think you have that backwards, bro. I haven't decided anything, I provided evidence for my arguments. Can you do that? Do you really know pot is bad for your lungs? Prove it. I don't care what you THINK, show me evidence.

I never once said pot is completely harmless. Show me where I said that.

What is a pot head?

You know why people use a bong, in addition to preference? To clean the smoke. It acts as a filter. That's why the bong water is dirty. It filtered.

Ever thought that singing.....might have ruined your voice? In smoke filled bars? Couldn't be that, it was pot damn it.

I didn't say pot was good for you, or harmless. Did I? Show me.

And....I posted the link to where I got some of my information. If you would have read it, you would no where the stupid information came from.

I think it would be a good idea to read up on stuff before you post such nonsnse. At least read the articles posted in a debate so you know what's going on. There is no reason for me to have to explain what the article I posted already has explained. Over and Over again with different people. You people have to be religious.  

"Reading coverage of marijuana research in the mainstream press increases the risk of becoming misinformed by 50-300%. More research is clearly needed to identify further sources of flawed marijuana reporting. The risk of bad reporting remains stable despite concerted efforts to inform the media that hysterical claims about marijuana frequently lack scientific merit. Exposure to poorly researched news about marijuana is correlated with support for costly, ineffective, highly punitive marijuana laws."


Now replace the word marijuana with religion. :o

Myth: Marijuana is More Damaging to the Lungs Than Tobacco. Marijuana smokers are at a high risk of developing lung cancer, bronchitis, and emphysema.

Fact: Moderate smoking of marijuana appears to pose minimal danger to the lungs. Like tobacco smoke, marijuana smoke contains a number of irritants and carcinogens. But marijuana users typically smoke much less often than tobacco smokers, and over time, inhale much less smoke. As a result, the risk of serious lung damage should be lower in marijuana smokers. There have been no reports of lung cancer related solely to marijuana, and in a large study presented to the American Thoracic Society in 2006, even heavy users of smoked marijuana were found not to have any increased risk of lung cancer. Unlike heavy tobacco smokers, heavy marijuana smokers exhibit no obstruction of the lung's small airway. That indicates that people will not develop emphysema from smoking marijuana.

Center on Addiction and Substance Abuse. “Legalization: Panacea or Pandora’s Box.” New York. (1995): 36.
Turner, Carlton E. The Marijuana Controversy. Rockville: American Council for Drug Education, 1981.
Nahas, Gabriel G. and Nicholas A. Pace. Letter. “Marijuana as Chemotherapy Aid Poses Hazards.” New York Times 4 December 1993: A20.
Inaba, Darryl S. and William E. Cohen. Uppers, Downers, All-Arounders: Physical and Mental Effects of Psychoactive Drugs. 2nd ed. Ashland: CNS Productions, 1995. 174.

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I guess your opinion is better than these, right?

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2006/05/25/AR2006052501729_pf.html

Me thinks Hooky's been hitting the crack pipe along with a power hitter...  ::)

Me thinks a lot of people have superstitious beliefs in other areas than just religion. I also think that evidence doesn't mean shit to those who think their ideas are correct. Fundy types.

Seems that if I were to quit smoking a substance as great and harmless as marijuana, I'd have to have a damn good reason based on facts and eidence. Just as I would have to have those facts and evidence to believe in God.  ;D ;D

Pot should be legal. Cigs and alcohol should be illegal. My opinion is that pot causes me no harm at all. I still have my voice, I don't have emphasema, I don't have cancer........I guess we are both right, or all correct. My resin is in my bong. My high is in my mind. I've decided I love jesus, whoever the fuck he is. ;D

Some like to argue agaist the benefits of a orange for the fear of choking to death on a seed.

CraigBert — Feb 11, 2009Me thinks Hooky's been hitting the crack pipe along with a power hitter...  ::)

Just a small victory for Dr. Hook. :D

Holy smokes spaivxx.....1/2 to 1oz. a day??  hahaha!

I'm no stranger to the kind....but that seems like a very large amount to me. I couldn't imagine trying to do that. ;D

The government needs to do a 5 year study on you!




Hook...listen to the wisdom of your elder! (DBM)  

Pot heads discredit their arguments when they follow this line of reasoning Hook. It is one thing to say "It should not be illegal", it is quite another to say that it is completely harmless. As I said once already, look at the bong water in your bong after a few good sessions, you don't think that shit gathers in your lungs too? I

That's right Hook!

There have been studies about the cleansing powers of a water pipe and some seem to indicate that is not as effective as people had thought. Read your Vaporizer adds  ;D

I think I read somewhere though...that your lungs are able to clean themselves when not damaged.  In your case(spaivxx) I think "that shit "would have gathered.

I wouldn't try to make an argument that pot is completly harmless on the lungs either.




 

I think they banned the dreaded reefer madness because it helps people see another facet of things, and it helps to see beyond what people are saying to why they are saying their words. In other words it is rather enlightening. At least it was for me. When I started smoking pot, I could see things I could not see normally. It did a thing with time for me and slowed the world down enough for me to catch ideas that flew by unnoticed before I turned on. I am talking 1964 here. I still recall the very first time I smoked it, and the changes it put me through. I think the Government considers that ability to see things not necessarily native to many people, and they don't want you to see through their purposes. That is why I think it is illegal. It is a threat to their dominance. Look at what happened during the hippy daze, all the protests, all of the unrest, all of the changes it put the world through. They are afraid of it amigo's. The devils weed drove me away from normalcy, and I never came back.


That's interesting.

I feel like it changed me as well.

It seems to me like this "change" is not the same with everyone who smokes it and I think some never have that feeling at all.

Some people I know who smoke look at it as just another way to get "fucked up"
Others....including myself,look at it in almost a spiritual way. A mind opening thing.

I think it has a lot to do with an individuals mental make up. Also many other things like ;what they expect,the setting,.......the time period in your life....you know,what's going on in your life at the time ect.

Also..I'm not sure....but I think some of the downside for some people who smoke are the "not so good" side effects of getting high.

I don't hear many pro legalization people talking about  the rapid heart beat,anxiety and panic attacks some people can get while smoking. Those are not any fun and don't feel very healthy. They may be relatively harmless,I don't know,but i wouldn't want one of my kids having to deal with that.

The 1/2 oz to oz a day was based on the couple ounces a day myself, my girlfriend at the time, and our little entourage used to consume. When you are "the pot guy" there are always pieces of shit that call themselves your friend hangin out smiling reaching for the bong, laughing at all your dumb stoner talk, etc... fucking sycophants. I kept a lot of them around just to use as errand runners and housekeepers and such. Basically the only time we were not smoking weed is if we were someplace where we might be arrested for doing so. Even, then, we might have been at times. My kids never saw me smoke, but when my son came to live with me, we had designaed areas of the house where the kids were just never allowed to go. "Kid free zones" we called them.

These days, I rarely smoke weed, maybe a couple times a week, most often during gigs. Playing covers can be so very boring but getting a nice buzz on and a few glasses of scotch in before hitting the stage and, well, it becomes a real hoot! I gott abe high or drunk if I am going to look like I am enjoying playing a song like "Keep Your Hands To Yourself"!

I did go a few years without smoking at all, between 04 and 06 I smoked maybe a couple times at all. There was a dramatic improvement in my voice and my breathing. My clarity of thought had improved as well, something difficult to objectively measure, it's just a feeling, but I knew the difference. I had quit again in mid 07 when I took a construction job with my bro and then some time in 08 I got a helper who sold herb on the side and he could not start work without a good buzz, I kinda got sucked into his routine of a joint before work, a joint at 9am break, a joint at lunch, a joint in the afternoon, and then one for the ride home (in Jax, it is almost inevitable that you have at least a half hour ride home form work, at least for me it always was, damn place is so spread out).

When I got laid off in November I quit again because I was looking for a job, once I reconciled myself with the fact that my cover band and the miscellaneous odd jobs I could find here or there were going to be my jobs for a while, I began indulging again.

I have friends who are islanders who truly believe that marijuana is sacred and that it si good for them. I haave other friends who, I guess to alleviate their minds because they smoke a lot, have to give the same arguments Hook has. I have had this debate 100's of times over the years. I think if you like to smoke pot, just fucking do it, but don't kid yourself into justifying it. It is illegal, I agree that it should not be. It is detrimental to ones health, but what isn't? Granted, it was more detrimental to my health than a lot of folks due to the quantities I used to enjoy.

Yeah, I'm sure it was bad for your health, as much as you smoked. And if you were to have read the studies I put up, they would agree with you and support it with evidence.

But they would also support my argument that the damage done by the occasional or normal pot smoker is minimal. And, the damage, or irritation done, goes away when you quit smoking. Not so with cigs.

Abuse of anything can cause long term problems. That's not my argument. Or, my irritation.

I like weed. I have no hangover the next day, music sounds better and food taste better....even sex is a tad better. I have no temper when smoking and I'm more patient with my kids and wife. Now other people's experience may differ, and that's fine. But don't give me this crap about lung damage, voice damage, and the picture on T.V. about how your brain gets scrambled on pot. It's bullshit and untrue. A bunch of crazy government sponsored programs spreading lies so the government can continue it's war on drugs and continue gathering the money up it collects from stupid bust. How the fuck can you tell me your voice was damaged from smoking pot while your constantly playing music and breathing in cig smoke in a nasty ass bar room with little or no ventilation? That's stupidity. Maybe you need to read about the effects of second hand smoke, which according to some, is worse than smoking itself. I bet you never considered that.

I'm sure pot smoke is a irritant to the lungs, at least. I'm not arguing that it isn't. Studies show tat it temporally is a irritant. But it doesn't cause cancer, or any other life threatening disease from what I've read. It's not addictive in the way cigs are. It's not any gateway drug or any crap like that.

I would like to see more studies done. But for now, we have what we have. And I choose to accept real studies done by credible and qualified people over a few people's myth based beliefs.

The line of thinking here is very little different than the superstitious religious nuts that seem to be on crack most their life.

I'd like to see a beer drinker win 14 or so gold metals in the Olympics. Obviously, pot just ain't that bad.

Mr Mahar agrees. ;D Well, I agree with him. ;D