26 posts
Just curious what some of you are using on clean guitars. You tracking with a pedal (or rack unit), going raw and then applying a plugin fav in your DAW? Or maybe a little of both? If it's a plugin, whatchu using?
Thanks
I use the stock compressors in Logic almost always on clean guitars (especially acoustic).
I don't always use a compressor pedal, but when I do, I prefer a Blackfinger. stay dynamic, my friends. ;) :)
I probably shouldn't be commenting, since I don't "track" anything, but I'm a big fan of the Barber Tone Press.
Sheep, Deano has one of those Blackfinger comps and really liked it as well.
Sheep, your $/02 is worth $37 and change. ;D
My first disc all the cleans were done using some form of line6 product so the compressors were from there as well. Since then I have used many different things but since i have not completed any songs nothing has really stuck. However, a couple months ago I picked up an Exotic SP Compressor on a whim (also picked up another pedal I never thought I'd afford - my local GC had a brand new Red Witch Deluxe Moon Phaser for $160 - more on that later)
Anyhow, the SP is great. I had to switch 2 of the internal dip siwtches, one is a PAD for use with high output pickups, and the other is some sort of high end filter - I set it to allow more highs, seems to be the right setting for humbuckers. then I have it set for a very gentle compression, (Lo on the switch) and the blend control is at about 11:30). I leave it on all the time now, clean and dirty. Gives me the perfect amount on my cleans, and i don't really notice it on the dirty one way or the other. In fact the rhythms in Searching have it on.
Great little 'pressor, can't wait to try it on recorded cleans.
OK, helpful info, thanks guys. I'm gonna have to revisit my copy of Cup O' and sample the tones. I suppose since I don't record a lot of clean stuff (but do want to do some soon) or play out with a band, a plugin is looking like the most practical option, nice to read they're apparently solid enough for home recordings. Now to track one down...
Ha didn't mean to suggest that my disc had great clean tones, more just going over what I used (Line 6 compressor of some sort within the patches).
I found that the Waves renaissance Axe plugin was very easy to use, although overpriced unless you are able to get it as part of a bundle or whatever.
Your DAW probably has something built in that should do the job.
Oh yeah, I hear ya - I was just saying it'd be a good reference, glad you mentioned it...and I still have my old trusty pod pro around here somewhere. (=
Gonna take a peek at whatever I have stick plugin wise as well. I also have a huge file of stuff on cd one IEG sent me a long time ago, might have a good one in there.
For pedals, the Ross is pretty much the source from which all else originates (the xotic is a Ross as well, I'd love to see a gut shot for what the switch does, but I have a pretty good idea). I think the Black Finger and White Finger are two of the most musical I've ever heard, but my real lust target (and one I'm currently building) is the pigtronix philosopher's tone. Not a subtle compressor, and optical, not VCA-based...
For plugins, pretty much anything that emulates a neve 33609 is going to be really good on guitars, as well as the old standby LA-2A or anything optical. The 1176 is faster and probably more useful over a wider range. Companies vary in their implementations, I like UA because I trust the engineer, he's one of my good friends, and I know they did their homework. But a DSP system with cards can be very unwieldy. Waves is good, I can't afford their stuff, but it's solid. McDSP too, those are my favorite "tweaking" comps, but the 33609, LA-2A, and 1176 are so no-frills and hard to mess up.
<edit>Just realized how the xotic sp switch works, since there's no "compression" knob--just three different preset resistances instead of the comp pot, and then it's got the blend knob, which is super handy. Every comp should have a blend knob... </edit>
Re: the Exotic - to add to that, there are 4 dipswitches inside, 2 for attack adjustments and then the 2 I mentioned.
It is a very cool little compressor, but I am a very lite user. Basically just wanted something to help smooth out my clean parts. Was very happy that it ended up being something I could set and forget.
charger — Sep 20, 2013but my real lust target (and one I'm currently building) is the pigtronix philosopher's tone. Not a subtle compressor, and optical, not VCA-based...
How funny, in a coincidental way. I just bought one of these (it arrived yesterday morning from Thomann). Not sure I really need it that often but I've been looking for a compressor for a while now that doesn't suck the main tone. Everything else I tried seemed to modify the underlying tone but the pigtronix seems to give me out what I put in but with various degrees of squish and also has a blend control to mix the original sound with a compressed version and has a built in distortion circuit too with the grit control.
Thanks again for the reply's. I would go for a pedal, something like the xotic based on ease of use I suppose, I just don't think I'd use it enough to spend the few dollars. I was able to track down the Waves emu plugs of the LA-2A & LA-3A compressors though and yeah, they'll do nicely! Only had an hour or so this weekend to mess with them but so far they're really powerful and sound great. Thanks for the suggestions.
Jon — Sep 21, 2013[quote author=charger link=1379676914/0#7 date=1379717754]but my real lust target (and one I'm currently building) is the pigtronix philosopher's tone. Not a subtle compressor, and optical, not VCA-based...
How funny, in a coincidental way. I just bought one of these (it arrived yesterday morning from Thomann). Not sure I really need it that often but I've been looking for a compressor for a while now that doesn't suck the main tone. Everything else I tried seemed to modify the underlying tone but the pigtronix seems to give me out what I put in but with various degrees of squish and also has a blend control to mix the original sound with a compressed version and has a built in distortion circuit too with the grit control.
Yeah, it's optical, and most compressors are VCA-based. Optical can be extremely squishy, but it also tends to seem more musical to me. And there's a blend, and a distortion circuit. Did you get the Germanium gold version, or the standard version?
charger — Sep 23, 2013[quote author=Jon G link=1379676914/0#9 date=1379744532][quote author=charger link=1379676914/0#7 date=1379717754]but my real lust target (and one I'm currently building) is the pigtronix philosopher's tone. Not a subtle compressor, and optical, not VCA-based...
How funny, in a coincidental way. I just bought one of these (it arrived yesterday morning from Thomann). Not sure I really need it that often but I've been looking for a compressor for a while now that doesn't suck the main tone. Everything else I tried seemed to modify the underlying tone but the pigtronix seems to give me out what I put in but with various degrees of squish and also has a blend control to mix the original sound with a compressed version and has a built in distortion circuit too with the grit control.
Yeah, it's optical, and most compressors are VCA-based. Optical can be extremely squishy, but it also tends to seem more musical to me. And there's a blend, and a distortion circuit. Did you get the Germanium gold version, or the standard version?
I wanted the germanium version but couldn't get one anywhere so I settled on the standard version.
I use a Soul Preacher. It's a fine fine fine compressor. I've gone through a lot of them and this one just has the magic built in. You can change the attack speed (fast, medium, slow) volume and sustain.
I've been a fan of one of two compressors (and they are very similar in tone). Maxon CP9 Pro+ and Carl Martin. The Maxon tends to be a more subtle compressor and is probably my fav. The Carl Martin can do as subtle as the Maxon, but has the ability to squish more.
I've had the Black Finger. Very Nice on clean tones; a little noisy for lead tones.
yeah, I don't use a compressor for lead tones so the noise doesn't bother me - but I can see how it would be a problem. on the other hand, the black finger maxed out is a pretty neat sound (acting as a tube comp + boost). noisy as hell, but still, pretty cool!
also, as a technical correction to the above, I use boat loads of compression for lead tones... just not a "compressor"... heh.
Just a curious question. For playing I use a Keely Compressor stomp (I've got Waves et. al. once things get to the PC - If they ever get there - lol!).
Since I don't know any of the new pedals you guys are talking about, which ones are similar to a Keely?
I'm with ya sheep, no big desire here for adding a compressor to already saturated tones either, though I'm sure if done lightly enough and with a transparent model, it can have a positive effect, as Paul just proved with his recent tune. Anyway, yesterday a friend came by so I could try his old boss CS-3 with my amp, guitars, etc. We went back and forth and though it's not a great/fair comparison (old, cheap and pretty noisy friggin compressor pedal, even on spanky cleans), the LA-3A plugin simply sounded better. Go figure...but I'm content and won't bother buying a compressor now for sure (I was gonna swap the RC for one but think I'll hang onto it and just use it towards a used AC when one shows because I agree again, in that video the AC was superior!).
Well, after i wrote that, i was experimenting some more and I think I will only use it on cleans from here on out, or at least more judiciously. Overall it sounds really good, but I'm not sure the effect it does have on cranked parts is always for the better. I was playing a riff in drop D where I really hammer the open lower 3 strings for effect and there was an obvious difference - the compressor was doing exactly what it was supposed to - but the riff was more dynamic and crushing without it.
Pretty cool demo/sample of some nice compressed cleans here...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DGHPVkVdyy4
CraigBert — Sep 24, 2013Just a curious question. For playing I use a Keely Compressor stomp (I've got Waves et. al. once things get to the PC - If they ever get there - lol!).
Since I don't know any of the new pedals you guys are talking about, which ones are similar to a Keely?
80% of all compressors are based on the Ross/Dynacomp (which are pretty much identical), and use a VCA for compression. Most pedals are slightly modified Ross pedals. Keeley, AnalogMan, Wampler, Boss, etc, are Ross. VCA compression is faster and less obvious than optical compression.
The Black Finger and White Finger are optical compressors with two separate opto sources (incandescent lamp or LED). The black finger has tubes in it as gain stages, but not as compression stages (not enough voltage to do that without making the pedal seriously dangerous and requiring expensive transformer). The white finger is the same thing, with FETs instead of tubes. The Pigtronix is also optical, but uses a vactrol instead of a LED/lamp and LDR. The Boss CS-1 is optical, with a very old, very slow, very squishy vactrol.
The Soul Preacher is based on the Orange Squeezer, which is one of the few non-Ross designs out there.
The CP9 is an OTA-based compressor but it's based on the LM13600/13700, which means more stages of compression, which might mean it's smoother. The carl martin is the rarity here, as it uses AC, a transformer, and a THAT chip to essentially put a DBX compressor in a stompbox.
Cool, thanks for the info!
It sounds like if I ever wanted to add another compressor just for variety that I'd want to get a nice optical one that isn't as transparent. :)
Yeah, one complaint about the VCA/CA3080 Ross/Dynacomp style compressors is that they can be very thin or bright. This isn't inherent in the compressor, but most designers cut the bass heavily to keep it from overwhelming the compression circuit and making the comp overcompressed. Interestingly, the other complaint with this style of compressor is that it can be very dark and not bright enough. So it loses from both ends.
Optical doesn't have the same problem--it doesn't matter if you cut the bass or not, it's going to be squishy.
IMHO, the ones with blend controls seem to work with everything. That's why I love the Barber. But it's not a squisher. It can be as subtle as you want. And it's VERY transparent. And Paul, with the blend, you can let those notes still crush (mix in as much un-comped signal as you want) and still have the added sustain where needed.
Kabala — Sep 20, 2013Just curious what some of you are using on clean guitars. You tracking with a pedal (or rack unit), going raw and then applying a plugin fav in your DAW? Or maybe a little of both? If it's a plugin, whatchu using?
Sorry to jump in late. I use hardware rack mount compressors, guitar into an ART tube compressor into a Tonelab Table top, which has a nice compressor in it as well, and then into a Rane line mixer and into a Really Nice Compressor in Super Nice Mode. That is straight in.
When I mike up my amp I use a SM57 into a Presonus VXP which has a de-esser and compressor in it,and a limiter on the output stage into the Rane and Really Nice Compressor.
I de-ess & compress it lightly in each stage in both cases. When it gets into the DAW in both cases, it is already pretty much tamed but not totally squashed.
charger — Sep 25, 2013
The Soul Preacher is based on the Orange Squeezer, which is one of the few non-Ross designs out there.
Well that explains why I like it so much. To me the difference between a Ross style and an Orange Squeezer is that the Orange Squeezer lets the nuances come through and a Ross style just kinda hides those things.
My compressor just seems to let me play regularly and not have to adjust to get certain things to jump out. And it doesn't fuck up the original tone with hissy shit.