13 posts
I've put the finishing touches on a 'project' guitar but for the life of me can't get the intonation even close, its WAY outta whack, unplayable at the moment. Are there simply some cases where a particular neck refuses to work well with body/bridge types or am I missing something with the process?
From what I understand, once tuned up (including floating bridge angle, string height, etc), starting with the high E, the 12th fret note (or harmonic ?) should match the open note - if its sharp, move the saddle towrds the tail. If flat, move it forward. My question is, when reading "tune up first", shouldn't that be to my preferred tuning (Eb)/setup, since thats how it will be used? This might be my mistake at the moment? Or is it that for intonation adjusting, STANDARD tuning FIRST is a must, then tweak the setup? Just a minor hassle as most know to get that desired angle + tuning with a floater, hate going through that process again if its still gonna be way off.
Anyone build a frankenstrat from scratch with oddly matched parts (neck/body) and pull this off properly?
thanks
I have one strong recommendation. Whenever trying to set up a guitar with a floating bridge, I block at the "level" position that I'll be adjusting it too, then do all adjustments to string height, intonation, etc. I'm not saying it's the only way, but trying to do adjustments when the bridge keeps changing was a nightmare for me. Find that level position, block it right there, make all your adjustments, then just fine tune your springs to get it back to level and you should be good to go. That's how I do it.
And yes, I'd do it in Eb if that's where it's going to live.
yeah, you have to re-set intonation if/when you change what you're tuned to.
I gave up on floating trems - just hate them all around.
I DO like the spring chamber sound though... so I've got my strat set up with the spring claw screwed all the way in and 5 springs on it - I could depress the (uninstalled) bar if I really really super wanted to, but it's not at all easy. it's definitely "wrong" but it works much better from my perspective - stays in tune on bends and with heavy pick attack. granted, "in tune" is something of a fungible as well since the action is high and I'm tuned to D... but at least the open strings don't go flat when I bend something.
I'd probably be better off with a hard tail strat.. but I kinda think the springs are part of the tone mojo - like a mini almost reverb tank... could be wrong there, but I believe it, so it might as well be true!! ;)
I'd probably "hear" a difference with a hard tail whether it was actually present or not. heh.
come to think of it, I KNOW I can hear the spring reverb effect on the PRS... but I left that trem floating... maybe that's part of it... dunno! I had to put a bunch of foam in there (the spring chamber) to dampen it. I don't play that guitar much anymore... damn floating trems!!! ;)
also... if the intonation is really far out of whack and you think there might be a neck scale/fit/size issue... get a tape measure and check the distance from the nut to the 12th fret. the saddle will end up in the neighborhood of that distance from the 12th fret too. if it's not even in the same ballpark, that's the problem.
OK, thanks. That gives me plenty to go on for now. Also, I just read that even saddle tweaks as small as 1/32 can alter the tuning (seems crazy but maybe so) and I was moving them much more than that (and getting nowhere)! I wan't this thing to play right, lol, would hate trying another neck on it but if I have to I will...it is pretty damn off ATM. And here I thought this would be a quick job and be playing the thing already, it may not even work PERIOD! >:(
BTW, I hear you on the floating issue, just that I don't really use many effects so I NEED that whammy at the very least (and a wah)! At least I have overcome my need for it as a vibrato, lol, that took some time.
oh yeah, definitely - small changes make big differences -- less than a 1/4 turn of the screw at a time once you're closing in on it.
remember to tune the string back to pitch after each adjustment on the saddle before checking intonation too... that's gotten me a few times! (yeah, I'll admit it!! ;D)
Yes, there are necks that will not work with certain bodies. We've put together quite a few now and it is not always possible to get the intonation right. It should be the same distance (or within the range of movement of the saddles) from the bridge and the nut to the twelfth fret. If it is not, there are only two things you can do. You can shim the neck longer by slipping something very thin between the back of the heel and the body (I like to use very thin guitar picks), or you can shave the end of the heel down with a file to shorten it. These steps will allow you to increase or decrease the distance from the bridge to the 12th fret. If you can get the 12th fret distances right, the guitar can probably be intonated, unless the fret spacing is wrong... a whole other issue.
EDIT -
should note that when you shim a neck for length (not for height or angle), you will have to fill the screw holes in the neck and redrill. Using the same holes will defeat the purpose. For this job, we like to take slivers of wood and jam them into the holes with wood filler, high solids grain filler, or wood glue, then coat the whole thing with a few coats of epoxy a la "zpoxy"--then sand that smooth.
Measure the string length if it is a Fender style 25-1/2" string length from the fret side of the nut to the center of the bridge adjustment travel it should be 25-1/2". Or PRS style string length at 25" Or Gibson style string length of 24-3/4" Baritone guitars I have no idea about them.
Well, no more issue....and if there was a facepalm emoticon handy, I'd fully deserve it now. Feel free to jab. :-[
The body I bought off a friend (who bought a guitar for his son who took a total of 2 lessons and quit) is a bari-tone body (basswood). I didn't know enough about this shit, my extra necks are not 24 frets, oops. The floyd on it sits further back obviously and that plus the neck I have (standard 25 1/5" 22 fret) is a no no. Maybe someday a better 24 fret neck will find its way to me on the cheap.
Oh well, it only cost me $100 and it does have a Korean made Floyd in black that I checked out extensively before I bought it, so I can use that elsewhere (plus the hardware). I still have an old strat style body that I can use the neck and floyd on...so one window closed and another project opened...
thanks for the help anyway!
Well, FWIW, here's the finished
alternate project guitar. Turned out ok, especially the playability, which is really all I wanted one for. The intonation is obviously correct. ;)
It has some nice pieces for a mix-matched guitar. The maple neck/board is an '81 Kramer with 'chicken beak' headstock - seen pics out there with Edward sporting one (circa '84) exactly like this. The frets are still in great shape (thank goodness for singers who buy nice guitars for use as props, lol) as well as the Shaller tuners. Also has an old skool German Floyd on it. Those pieces prolly deserve a better body actually (this is basswood), but hey, it's good enough for me. Pickups are DiMarzio's.
probably needs a nicer body? All it needs is a nice white pearloid pick guard. ;) That looks pretty rockin' too me.
Actually I think a black or blue pearloid would look sharp also.