24 posts
Hey, I'm looking for a new home stereo.
Here's what I need:
Good, clean sound. Enough volume for the whole house, system based in living room.
CD/MP3 CD Player/tuner... standard stuff.
Ipod/iPhone integration.
Cost: 500 or less ideally.
Plusses/nice to haves:
USB input (flash drive integration, etc.)
Ability to add more rooms (outside speakers, den speakers)
What I don't need:
5.1/6.1/7.1
Blu Ray
DVD
I am actually looking for a MUSIC system... something that plays stereo music. I'm not looking for a surround system or a TV system, in fact there is no TV in the living room, that's in the den.
not really my area. If you look at a few, I can give you brand preferences.
OK...
Harman Kardon HK3490 (299) + Ipod dock ($129)
Sony speakers: SS-B3000 bookshelfs + stands (90+ maybe 50)
or
SSF-5000 floor standing (122)
Around $500-$550 all told.
I would love to get something like Aperion Audio 5B's but at $225 a piece, + need for a sub, that's probably out of my range, in fact that's near my entire budget. Then I'll go grab some speaker wire at Fry's and run it all over the place. Also might look at a second set of speakers for the den, or a set for the backyard, the amp's got A and B outs.
I can't find great specs for the Sonys so I am going by reviews... they're 87 and 88db/watt respectively. But no freq charts, etc. I figure if I go this route I can get a sub later if I need it.
Or maybe an onkyo? I went and listened to some at fry's, and given that they were all plugged into different speakers, and the listening environment sucked, I thought the Onkyos and HKs sounded the best and operated the most logically of all the receivers... and, ya know, my wife needs to be able to operate the durn thing.
yeah, you're on it. Onkyo and HK are generally the best in that range as far as receivers.
Not familiar with the speakers. I'm not as up on those as i used to be, but know that NHT still has some great stuff that's cheap.
HK and Onkyo are both really good. Won't go wrong with either. Onkyos are maybe a touch warmer, but not much. Very close in quality. Owned both.
+ 1 for Onkyo. That's what I have in the living room. Very reliable and exceptional sound quality. Use it for the Blu Ray/HD surround sound as well. Never had an issue with my now three year old TX-SR606 (and it gets used heavily, lol). It's 7.1, clean, decodes all the HD codecs, has multiple HDMI in/outs and cost me just under 500 back when I bought it new. As I've been upgrading speakers in the living room/home theater, I've been passing down the older sub and speakers to the bedroom where I have the PS3 (so I'm kinda creating a 'mini theater' in there now)....I'll be picking up a similar Onkyo to power that shit (or possibly a beefier model for the main room).
edit: another nice feature with the Onkyo units (though I'm sure the other brands have something similar)...is that they come with a mic and a nifty internal speaker calibration tool to get optimal sound for whatever room your running it in. It helps you setup your sub and speakers for surround sound with proper levels, distances, balance, etc, by bouncing a signal around the room and then measuring and calculating, then automatically setting. I know you said it'll be mostly "for music", but it's still a sweet tool.
Phase 1 is complete: I've just picked up a set of Phase Technology Teatro 7.5, 6.5, & 4.5 speakers, floor standing + center + bookshelf, + a JBL 12" powered sub. They fit all my criteria--great reviews, good enough for straight music listening, and amazing looking with a cherry veneer.
These are the floor-standers:
http://www.audioreview.com/cat/speakers/floorstanding-speakers/phase-technology/teatro-7-5/PRD_127530_1594crx.aspx
The 6.5 is the center channel and the 4.5 are bookshelf speakers. All beauties, and the price was right, $400 for the set. The old owner threw in a receiver which I took as a stopgap until I get my next pile of stock options cashed out... It's a Sony STR-DE698 system, 90 watts/channel, though given the underwhelming reviews and the low initial price 2-3 years ago, I'm guessing those are marketing watts. Anyway, it will hold us over until I get the next piece.
Right now I'm waffling between a bunch of options in the $2-400 range.
- something like the Onkyo TX-8555 -- a true stereo receiver, 100w/c with two zones-- I can run the bookshelf speakers in another room or put up some outdoor speakers. Or the Onkyo TX-8511 which is basically the same thing but older. Advantage of those is that they can control my iPod with the iPod dock (extra money but well worth it).
- Same idea, more channels. Onkyo TX-60*, 70*, 80*. There's a TX-805 near me on CL for dang cheap, and that thing's got 7.1 covered, HDMI, billions of connections, and 130 watts per channel. That's just downright nasty!
- Or, and this is where I start to get a little nutty, something from the 70's, like the Sansui 9090. 120 w/c and probably actually sounds "warm", etc. Not talking .08% THD with one of those, probably more like 1%. Just crunchy. I find old 70's receivers to be ridiculously beautiful, and the Sansui is no exception... it's got blue lights and needle meters... a real stunner. Of course, it's old and would mean no iPod control, hell, no remote control at all, I'd have to find a remote for my iPod and actually turn the knob by hand... but anyway, that's my current thinking. http://www.fmtunerinfo.com/Sansui9090left.jpg
I still use my Adcom gfa-555: http://www.stereophile.com/solidpoweramps/678/
Going strong for over 20 years. Very nice amp.
I'm with ya on the Sansui...
I would love to own a vintage tube system. A friend had McIntosh that was warm and sweet.
Many older Fisher tube stereos out there. Tha Sansui and others of that generation really captured my attention... I remember a friend who had one of that era when I was a kid. So many switches and knobs! Problem is, how do I convince the wife and kids that it's a good idea to spend $300 on something that looks like it belongs on the Love Boat, has no remote, and probably audible noise at 70dB S/N? I bet it sounds amazing... warm and sweet... Man, would I love to need two stereos!
Sounds like a kick-ass system - couldn't see it though, it appears that the link doesn't work for me.
Back when I HAD to have this type of stereo, I used Yamaha amps and they worked very well for me (100w per channel, 7.1 channels - speakers were Bose with a powered subwoofer).
The best stereo I've heard recently was this tiny, low-wattage DIY with 1/8" solid copper wire as it's cabling and a killer powered subwoofer. I got to hear it because the guy was buying my audiophile Sound Dynamics speakers. It was amazing!
This won't help but....
I've been so impressed with the behringer monitors I've decided to put 4 of them in a room, hook to a usb capable mixer...and have digital music through my computer, like Pandora and itunes etc, and the ability to hook up a cd player in addition to the mixer. The Behringer monitors are kinda a mix between studio monitor sound and above average stereo system speakers. Huge sound to fill a room and very clean with a good mixer, compared to all the big stereo systems out there. A really good sound if placed right. And, you can hook a mp3 player to the mixer as well. With the mixer and sub par Behringers, you can dial in some bass and treble etc and they'll handle it well.
I'd even like a pair hooked to my TV as well.
The behringers use to run about $230 pair, mixer around a $100. Just a thought.
Sounding like a killer setup now! I like the cherry, nice choice - wish I woulda went that way as well looking back, had the option, went with black for some reason.
90 watts per channel is still plenty loud/clean enough until "phase 2" is complete, especially if the particular room it's trying to fill is not all that big, nice score there as well, and you can always demote that piece to a smaller room when ready.
The receiver is inadequate... I get it up to 40 or so on the volume (not sure what that translates to dB-wise, but put it this way, it's not "loud"--my computer speakers get louder-- and the amp shuts down, goes into protect mode. These speakers need power. I think I'm looking for something with 115-130 watts p/c. But it's okay for quiet listening.
what is their efficiency rating? You shouldn't need that much power. At least not "good power." Unless they are very low efficiency. Some speakers just won't get loud.
charger — Oct 26, 2010 ...(not sure what that translates to dB-wise, ...)...
You know, "there's an app for that" (free for the Droids - my business partner has it, don't know about the iPhones). :)
They're actually pretty efficient, the towers are rated at 90dB which I assume means 90dB/1watt/1kHz? And the bookshelf speakers are rated at 89dB. I can get the amp up to around 38 or 39. I am not sure but I think the digital counter goes up to 79, then hits Max. So it's definitely not putting out anything like its rated power before it trips.
One thing is for sure, even through this fairly crap amp, listening to iPhone audio out of the headphone jack, these speakers sound incredible. Nothing hyped, smooth throughout the frequency range, they have a very real and true response. We've had the music going nonstop now for two days and the soundstage in the living room is now well filled with music.
But like I said, to get it loud, I'm going to need a receiver that has some serious hardware in it. The Sony runs hot even at a volume of "15" (what I'm listening to now with my 2 year old asleep in the next room). There's a heat sink in there but the metal used for it looks cheap and just looking at the design through the slits in the case I can see how air could get trapped in it. And the transformer doesn't appear to be particularly beefy. This amp is made for people to watch TV with tiny speakers and a big sub, not to push stereo music through full range speakers.
Anyway, here are the specs on the bookshelf speakers:
http://www0.epinions.com/specs/pr-Phase_Technology_Teatro_4_5_Home_Audio_Main_Stereo_Speaker
And the towers:
http://www0.epinions.com/specs/pr-Phase_Technology_Teatro_7_5_VDT
Next set of stock options comes due on the 1st...
Also I need to build my speaker cables...
Any opinions on what gauge to use? I'd love to use 18 or 16, minimize the wire and get more per dollar... I could go 14, but I won't go 12 or 10, I think that's unnecessary and prohibitively expensive. I'm looking at my longest run being somewhere around 20 feet. If I get crazy and run satellite speakers through the attic to the dining area, that might be a 35 foot run.
Anyone? Recommended purchasing sites and brands? And please, no one suggest Monster cable, I'm not going there.
I went all out in my condo (and, no, I definitely did not use Monster cable for the speakers). I bought in-wall wire off the spool from Home Depot (I believe it was 14 gauge), but I then ran it through aluminum conduit (to shield the wire from power cables and any other interference) and then built crown molding over the conduit. Here's a few pictures of the living room in my condo (taken when I was selling). In the first two there's a hard-to-see flat area running from floor to ceiling in each corner with conduit hidden (one behind my TV to send wires up and one near the sofa to send wires back down for an under-the-sofa type subwoofer. An extra power cable is in there as well on the outside of the conduit - it's used for the track lighting.
http://www.nwdreamer.com/Pics/Houses/IrvineCondo/living1.JPGhttp://www.nwdreamer.com/Pics/Houses/IrvineCondo/living2.JPGIn this third picture you can see the main crown molding and one of my Bose speakers. Do you see the rather thin cabinet in the back of the picture? I added that for this reason:
http://www.nwdreamer.com/Pics/Houses/IrvineCondo/cdanddvdcabinet1.JPGNow, I doubt you'll want to go to that effort, but I thought I'd show the design since the crown molding did add a lot of refinement to the room and the sound was amazing (plus it didn't cost much - more time consuming than anything else). If you just go with unprotected wiring, avoid running it parallel to power wires (cross at 90 degrees if possible). But you probably already knew that. ;)
Weird as fuck... I finally tossed the old, hugely thick (10 gauge?) short speaker cables that the system came with. replaced them with new ones, 14 gauge, cut to length, wired them straight into the speakers and put pins on the ends for the receivers. Using only the two floorstanding speakers, suddenly the receiver can go really loud. I was able to crank it to 50+ (at which level it was shaking the house) without the amp going into protect mode. So I'm guessing one of two things... the old speaker cables were bunk (not very likely) or the connections were put on wrong, and one of the positive or negative connections was loose, causing something actually unsafe to occur in the power amp.
Anyway, the floorstanders kick ass. Now on to the new amp... mother in law was visiting and offered to buy the new receiver for us---and gave me a budget about 3x as big as my own budget. So I'm getting the Onkyo TX-NR808, new. $700 shipped, no tax... HELL YEAH!
Are we going to hear about the San Andreas going off with the epicenter at YOUR house Charger? ;D
Sounds like you definitely don't have the typical MIL either!
NICE! (The received and the MIL!)
Got the Onkyo TX-NR808 yesterday. Massive and beautiful. More features than I can even really believe. I can plug it straight into my network router and stream Pandora right from the web, or stream audio from another PC on the network to the receiver... it's got a USB input and when I plugged my iPhone into it, I could control it from the Onkyo remote... 7.1, but like I said, I'm going stereo, so I've got it set up for stereo + sub. Two mains right now, I need to crawl up into the attic so I can run wires to another room for the bookshelf speakers I'm going to run off the Zone 2 outputs. It's also got unpowered Zone 3, and pre outs for every channel, so I can pretty easily run cables to a power amp and run audio for other rooms. I can't even really go into all the features, I'm basically using almost none of them. But at 135 watts per channel (!), it sounds incredible. Just off Pandora/iPhone it sounds amazing--playing high bitrate MP3s off the iPhone sounds even better. I wonder if I need a CD player... Best part, after running all day and much of the evening, it's warm, but not hot. The cheap Sony got seriously hot.
glad you're enjoying it. Onkyo is good stuff in the receiver arena. Enjoy!
